FJRiders.com

N4HHE wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:03 pm

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:26 pm OEM Stator...yes, I remember that bastard aftermarket stator the previous owner put on my 04 that crapped out on me on a rainy Sunday evening on westbound US64 east of Murphy, TN.

Not familiar with Murphy, TN?
Especially not on US-64.

Whoops, NC.

Had chance to give the old girl a good run. Several shorter rides since the recall.

Happy to report everything stayed together after a very extended wfo run on one of our backwoods play grounds.


Canadian FJR

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:43 pm

N4HHE wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:03 pm

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:26 pm OEM Stator...yes, I remember that bastard aftermarket stator the previous owner put on my 04 that crapped out on me on a rainy Sunday evening on westbound US64 east of Murphy, TN.

Not familiar with Murphy, TN?
Especially not on US-64.

Whoops, NC.

Ah! I'll remember in the future that that is a good place to have a stator failure!

N4HHE wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:52 am

wheatonFJR wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:43 pm

N4HHE wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:03 pm

Not familiar with Murphy, TN?
Especially not on US-64.

Whoops, NC.

Ah! I'll remember in the future that that is a good place to have a stator failure!

I had a flat once, leaving Murphy on a Sunday morning...

New Electrosport stator:



30k mile Electrosport, a few days before EOM. The top two lobes are shorted together:



OEM stator at ~80k miles:



At least my Electrosport had the decency to fail at home.

I went to the local to me Rick's Motorsports Electrics and talked with them about perhaps making a stator for the FJR. They kindly gave me the "What are you, stupid?" explanation of why it's a bad idea. They said that when you make 20% more power or more, within the same space, with the same cooling, any stator is going to fail early. They were actually impressed that the Electrosport lasted as long as it did.

My Electroshit stator on my 03 lasted about 50k. I think I was lucky. I replaced it with the stock and ended putting about 100k on that with no problem before I sold it.

Yeah, my electrosport stator that the PREVIOUS owner had installed didn't have the decency to die at a motel. Side of the US64, Sunday night, riding alone, raining. My hero was an HD riding, sleeveless T-shirt wearing, guy in a truck...who stopped to see if I needed assistance. Came back with a landscape trailer and got my bike to the motel in Murphy. Where, in desperate straights, I got that bike up a uhaul truck with no one else around to help get the bike up the ramp or take pictures in case I fell off the (narrow to me) ramp when the bike miraculously restarted.

Finally got to pick her up from my bil's from her winter nap. Short ride home. Adjusted air pressure in the tires. Slapped on this year's registration sticker. Quick visual check and we're ready to roll. Rain forecasted for today so next nice day maybe give her a wash.

Give and take on some problems so far. After discovering that my front brake pins are frozen a week or so ago I spritzed them with some penetrating oil a couple of times and thermally soaked the calipers -- rode the bike hard. Today I took my hand impact wrench to the pins again. They all came free with a satisfying POP. Some took a couple more whacks than others but they are now free. I was holding off on buying brake pads until I was sure I would actually be able to replace them.

I'm procrastinating on taking the bodywork off my bike to troubleshoot low voltage at the battery. I dunno, maybe the garage elves will come fix it some night. I have verified that none of my add on doodads are responsible. I'm going to put the trickle charger back on the battery and verify that the new battery will accept a charge willingly. When I was giving the battery its initial charging it was accepting 900 mA of current at 13.5 volts from my trickle charger.

I have been riding in NE Oregon for the last six days. Whoo hoo too much fun.

Is this Mrs. April for the 2022 FJRiders calendar?



The photo is Hwy 218 near Shaniko Oregon. Hard to get a good photo here because the road is heading SE so I arrived in afternoon but it is still blown out. More green would help. It is early in season and it is has been very dry this year so it may not get more lush.

Hwy 218 is about 36-40 miles and today I road it as a down and back. This is the western edge of my down and back. It is tough duty to ride 80 miles on a great road.

Look at the gnarly chip seal around the front tire. That poor Shinko took a beating. Thankfully about only half the Hwy 218 was resurfaced last year, the rest is much smoother than this. I hate cheap seal. I got 4k on the Shinko Raven 009. The front is scalloping and the side of the tire is showing wear. Good amount of tread at the center though. Rear tire is just fine. Other than the front tire side wearing these tires are doing well. More testing is required!

Any tire rebates going one now?

ionbeam wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 11:26 amI'm procrastinating on taking the bodywork off my bike to troubleshoot low voltage at the battery. I dunno, maybe the garage elves will come fix it some night. I have verified that none of my add on doodads are responsible. I'm going to put the trickle charger back on the battery and verify that the new battery will accept a charge willingly. When I was giving the battery its initial charging it was accepting 900 mA of current at 13.5 volts from my trickle charger.

Ionbeam,

FWIW, if you have a Digital Volt Meter: Any given wire should have about the same Voltage at the inlet and outlet ends. That applies, for both powered and ground wires. If you measure from the positive terminal of the battery, for example, then the far end of any one wire should show about the same voltage. From start to finish, the Voltmeter should show almost zero volts, along the path of that wire. If there is a significant Voltage drop along that path, maybe half a Volt or more, depending on the wire size and length, then that wire probably has a problem. Usually this will be caused by corroded connectors or terminals. Likewise, there should be little or no Voltage drop along any ground-path wires. The Voltmeter should indicate near zero Volts, in each case. Clean the terminals to shiny-bright using a fine-wire "toothbrush" - the auto parts stores will have them. For the insides of connectors, an aerosol spray Contact Cleaner is a good bet; spray the pins, then mate and un-mate the connector several times. Use compressed air to blow out (dry) the contact cleaner from the connector. HTH.

ionbeam wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:06 pm ...I'm pretty sure that the problem is going to be voltage drops in the wires between the R/R, the starter relay and the the battery. The ~14 gauge wires from the R/R go directly to the starter relay...There are no connectors between the R/R and the starter relay...

[Joan Rivers]Oh sure, look who knows so much.[/Jone Rivers]

So, the Red Regulator output wire goes to the vicinity of the main key switch where a tie point joins wires going to the key switch, and the fuse box and also the main fuse. Then the main fuse goes to the starter relay power stud and then to the battery on the heavy battery cable. The Black Regulator output wire goes to the engine ground. The battery gets charged through the 50 amp main fuse. I now seem to recall that I had to replace the main fuse in my '04 because of a large voltage drop across the fuse. Anyhoo, the main fuse is the first, most easy thing to access and is sort of the middle of the circuit so it should point out the direction I need to go in.

I'll probably wait until all the smoke dust has settled and do a write-up if I find anything good to pass on.

I put a sticker on it that was well overdue.

ionbeam wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:59 pm

ionbeam wrote: ↑Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:06 pm ...I'm pretty sure that the problem is going to be voltage drops in the wires between the R/R, the starter relay and the the battery. The ~14 gauge wires from the R/R go directly to the starter relay...There are no connectors between the R/R and the starter relay...

[Joan Rivers]Oh sure, look who knows so much.[/Jone Rivers]

So, the Red Regulator output wire goes to the vicinity of the main key switch where a tie point joins wires going to the key switch, and the fuse box and also the main fuse. Then the main fuse goes to the starter relay power stud and then to the battery on the heavy battery cable. The Black Regulator output wire goes to the engine ground. The battery gets charged through the 50 amp main fuse. I now seem to recall that I had to replace the main fuse in my '04 because of a large voltage drop across the fuse. Anyhoo, the main fuse is the first, most easy thing to access and is sort of the middle of the circuit so it should point out the direction I need to go in.

I'll probably wait until all the smoke dust has settled and do a write-up if I find anything good to pass on.

Harness kit from roadstercycle was dcarver's fix IIRC

https://roadstercycle.com/

I wonder if chronic undercharge contributed to early demise of the original battery?

FJRoss wrote: ↑Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:41 am Harness kit from roadstercycle was dcarver's fix IIRC

https://roadstercycle.com/

I wonder if chronic undercharge contributed to early demise of the original battery?

Thanks for the tip. The charging system and electrical system were 100% when my FJR went down for its winter nap. The battery is 5 years old and has twice previously been deeply discharged. Over the course of this winter the battery voltage dropped way more than normal over a short time which may have led to the battery freezing. I only trickle charged the battery once this winter which is less than normal. Even if I kept the trickle charger on the battery it probably would have only slightly delayed the battery's death.

Red wrote: ↑Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:47 pm FWIW, if you have a Digital Volt Meter: Any given wire should have about the same Voltage at the inlet and outlet ends...

Thanks for the guide. I have also posted Voltage Drop troubleshooting instructions a few times. I have a collection of volt meters, amp probes and a couple of oscilloscopes for good measure

Yesterday I used the pigtail that's connected directly to the battery and measured 13.1 volts with the engine running. I pulled the panel off that's over the battery and measured directly on the battery posts and the battery connectors and got 13.1 running volts. With some fiddling I removed the 50 amp main fuse from its rubber mount, unplugged the fuse and ohmed it. It was good. I plugged the fuse back in and back-probed one end of the fuse connector and started the engine. 14.2 volts. I checked the other post. 14.2 volts. I went to the battery and measured 14.2 volts. WTF? Repaired by means of The Laying On Of Hands.

I hate it when things get 'fixed' without finding the root cause and repairing it. I left everything open and will go back today and see if I can cause the failure again. I'd really like to know what went wrong and get it fixed. Right now the best guess is a contact problem with the main fuse. I wish it wasn't 30° in my garage this morning.

At least you know where to start looking when it happens again. Do you have a voltmeter display to catch it early? Any evidence of heat damage to anything? With a 1 V drop, shouldn't something be getting warm?

I still have the OEM battery in my 2011. Starts the bike easily but I think reserve capacity is marginal. It has also had a couple of deep-discharge "events" - some idiot left the key on. It gets a "top-off" charge typically twice between mid-December and mid-March (unheated garage). No battery tender ever. Hope to get another year out of it.

I have never had a problem leaving my lawn equipment or bike batteries plugged into a Battery Tender for months at a time. Other brands claim similar, but I like that brand and have been doing this over 15 years, I have 4 of them.
There may have been some contact issue with the main fuse, but consider that when you pulled it, you essentially rebooted the ECU and any other modules. Might have been some freak of unusual electronic nature, and yes, hate when that happens..... I also install voltmeters on my bikes to know where they are at all times.

I had a regular Datel and a backlit Datel on my '04. Then my next radar detector had a built in a volt meter. The detector's volt meter is sufficient as a trend indicator but would never replace a voltmeter for absolute accuracy. It mattered with my '04 due to the 470 watt electrical system. The Gen 2 & 3 has enough power increase at 590 watts that voltage accuracy isn't as important. It was the detector that showed the electrical anomaly.

Removing the main fuse shouldn't have 'reset' anything electrical. Even with the main fuse removed the ABS motor, ABS solenoid and the radiator fan relay are still powered. The ECU and meter assembly will lose things like the clock and the trip odometer.

Datel installed in my '04:

ionbeam wrote: ↑Thu Apr 22, 2021 8:21 am Yesterday I used the pigtail that's connected directly to the battery and measured 13.1 volts with the engine running. I pulled the panel off that's over the battery and measured directly on the battery posts and the battery connectors and got 13.1 running volts. With some fiddling I removed the 50 amp main fuse from its rubber mount, unplugged the fuse and ohmed it. It was good. I plugged the fuse back in and back-probed one end of the fuse connector and started the engine. 14.2 volts. I checked the other post. 14.2 volts. I went to the battery and measured 14.2 volts. WTF? Repaired by means of The Laying On Of Hands.

No, you actually properly found the problem and cured it. Oxidation forms on electrical contacts and can often be cured by simply cycling the contact. Take the fuse out, put the fuse in, problem solved. This is an important concept in the design of relays and electrical switches. Switch contacts deliberately slide to self-clean.

Is also one of the reasons computer boards quit using sockets except for extreme need. Was easier to service but the socket was far more likely to fail than the chip.

Folklore dictates one use "di-electric grease" on everything. I strongly disagree. "Di-electric" is engineer-speak for "insulator". There are conductive coatings one can use to keep oxygen out but maintain conductivity. No-Ox in the electrical building supply center comes to mind but the problem is if this flows to other contacts a short is formed. I have had good luck using DeoxIT D100L. A small bottle is $9 from Amazon, perhaps enough to last a lifetime. Not really conductive but has rescued a number of marginal connectors.

ionbeam wrote: ↑Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:07 am Removing the main fuse shouldn't have 'reset' anything electrical. Even with the main fuse removed the ABS motor, ABS solenoid and the radiator fan relay are still powered. The ECU and meter assembly will lose things like the clock and the trip odometer.

Removing the fuse wiped the contacts on the fuse and its socket. Therein was the problem.